A new Post from Spencer, Answering E.

Question for Spencer–How do you keep a balance of living in this world (i.e. the culture of this world) with striving for Zion? As I have read your story, I too am filled with joy and a deep desire to prepare myself for a Zion life. I find myself becoming more and more serious and my conversations becoming “heavy” to those around me. I have intense desires for a Zion life–I have ever since I was a young child and became “aware.” I find that this is not good for my children who need a mother who is “light” and unburdened by the call. Yet when I learn these things of Zion, the cultural norms of our world (I’m speaking of things that would be considered “acceptable” to our LDS culture–movies, TV, books, politics, medical practices, to name a few) seem to repulse me and I become more unrelatable–respected, but unrelatable. How then do you, knowing what you so definitively know, operate as a father, husband, friend, community member, etc.?

E, I will attempt to discuss this process. May the Lord be with me.
When we are shown the great love and compassion the Savior has for all that He has been given by the Father. Who we are, every one of us has been given to Christ by the Father or we would not be on this site.. He knows our needs, and our wants. When we see this clearly, our needs and wants diminish considerably, we change and we see the process so much clearer and far more deeply. This clarity is then imparted to us in regards to what all of us must past through so we can lay this mortal by and put it all, everything, holding nothing back on the altar and consider each person in their present place, in their present progression in a new light. The Lord gives us this vision and we become changed by it. Dificult, Yes. Necessary, for sure. He then shows us our standing before the Lord, as we progress through this veil of tears and into the place where Zion penetrates our wanderings and daily walk until it consumes us. The things of this world then seem to start taking care of themselves. A transition takes place in us and our efforts can then become multiplied, blessed and sanctified. People then begin to know instinctivly that we love them in ways that are higher then how we used to Love, act and how we used to be. Higher than the lone and dreary world which bogs us down and causes us to flee from the world because we are fearful it might splash on us and contaminate our efforts. Because it certainly has the tendency to drag us down with it.
We then no longer are motivated out of attraction, lust or the desire for status or power or gain. Our pride becomes swollowed up in the Love He shows us and the purpose that burns in our bones like a fire shut up within them. Our desire to do this and become this, is known by the Lord in the same fashion that we are known.
We than start treating others as He treats us. They become caught up in the rapture of His purposes and begin to accept all other souls in the place they dwell and our desires become the spark which moves them to see with new eyes and feel with a new heart. Others than begin to lift up their heads and turn to the Lord and transform themselves bit by bit till they are no longer comfortable with where they reside and live. The discomfort of it all cause them to shift, move and reevaluate their present status.Through this they then begin to look to Him and Do all that they do in the Name of the Lord, that He may begin to sanctify their service, work, thoughts and actions to their own good and the good of all that are around them. We can not become a community of Monks and bring this wortk forward.
Thus Zion is established. For the desire of Zion is to become one. One in heart, one in purpose, one is spirit. O N E ! Even as The Father and the Son are ONE. This becomes a mighty work. The energy continues to grow and like “ Hurricane Sandy” it becomes a mighty force that desroys, shakes up and causes change, all old things are taken away or destroyed and the only place to move is to stand still and mourn or move forward and learn of Him who is the author of this change.
Recall with me in the garden of Eden, on the Tree of Good and Evil, on this very tree which the Father and the Son had planted, we find opposition. Good and Evil. Change comes from loss, pain, struggle movement. We must recall, the Lord said, “Be ye therefore even as I am”. To align with Him we must be like Him. And often that takes going below it all while also being above it all. Can we receive only those parts of sanctification which are glorious, without seeing, and experiencing that which is painful, trying and difficult? I do not believe this is the path. He will succor us. He will lead us along. It is the path to Him and the Path to Zion. Jesus is the Way the Truth and the Life. I testify of Him in the Name of Jesus Christ Amen. (Spencer)

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18 Responses to A new Post from Spencer, Answering E.

  1. robert putman says:

    oh how i long for a pure and light filled zion life, my true path to the Savior began when my life changes from my health, and i reached out for the only one who i knew could save me in my biggest quest, my spiritual growth, i have to say i thank Spencer for the light he has been able to shed on so many things, most of all the continued Testimony of the Christ.


  2. Lorie Davis says:

    I very much enjoyed the spirit of the comments about this blog. Another answer to E, which I cherish in my heart was a comment offered by the late Truman G. Madsen, a dear friend and mentor: (paraphrased because I can’t find the quotation) “We were admonished against being ‘light-minded’, but not against being ‘light-hearted.'” Joseph Smith was such a great example of a man who could be spiritually deeper than any other mortal, but was always cheerful, welcoming, enjoyed clean play and laughing aloud. Those four qualities are welcomed by all children, husbands, wives and friends. Nobody knows (especially my family) how deeply and intensely I think and care about spiritual things. But I try to make good cheer the outward expression of my inner spirituality. When I succeed (not always!) it works to lift others.


  3. John H. Schoppe says:

    Amen and amen!


  4. Brittani says:

    Thank you so much E for asking this question! It is something that I too have struggled to understand how to bring about in myself. I have wanted to leave the worldly things behind, but have young children who need to have a mom who is fun and child like at heart. Sometimes they seem so opposite, but in my heart I know that they aren’t. I am also very thankful to (Spencer) for answering this question. It gives me a lot to think about and a lot implement into my life. I know that the Lord led me to this site specifically to find answers I have been searching for, as well as to have my soul buoyed up!


  5. Miles France says:

    Spencer, Thank you so much for all you have done to help us on our journey. My wife and I are currently reading the Old Testament and it is very rich with the warnings concerning Idolatry. Can you say anything to us concerning our modern idolatries, maybe even concerning Santa Clause being taught in the Church through actions?


    • Ramona says:

      I Am not Spencer, and I am no expert, but remember Santa is a symbol. There is a gorgeous book called “I Believe in Santa Claus” that shares special traits in regards to this figure, and then shows these figures also are true for Christ…ie: He comes in the night, He loves children, He grants us gifts…etc. i can’t tell you whether or not you should practice that tradition, but it brings me comfort to know there are plenty of spiritual connections there, if you seek them. I also find it interesting that the brethren often refer to Santa Claus and the sweet traditions he instills during their Christmas talks. This tells me there is a proper way to practice this tradition.

      As our family no longer has little ones we have been able to help other families at Christmas. We help in the ward, buy gifts for a local angel tree, and all year fill a “Christmas Jar” and then pray about who to give it to. These things allow us to be ‘Santa’ and give anonymously. For that reason alone I am so glad we honored this tradiiton in our home, and I feel it has truly been a blessing for our family, but that is just my experience.


  6. Chris says:


    Though you stumbled through your answer and the words didn’t flow smoothly, they say a lot. I’m grateful for your willingness to speak after all you’ve already shared. Thank you. All that John has shared has been such a blessing to all of us in my family as we discuss the gospel without limits. God bless you, my brother.


    • (Spencer) says:

      Chris, Stumbled is the correct terminology. I am not John in my writing. I lack so very much. I was with a Patient yesterday and she began to speak ill of her husband who is a very troubled soul. The spirit up and went in this exchange. It was offended. I knew it immediately. I had to repent and plead it’s return. For to live a minute without it’s influence is unpleasant at best. We are all on this road to have His spirit to be with us. Let’s keep climbing, striving and pleading together, for we are never done until it is over. My love for this community grows daily. Thank you for sharing so openly. For in Christ all things are known. Not judged. Accepted and the wheat and the chaff are gathered together. They are then sifted and the chaff blown away to be remembered no more.


  7. Scott says:

    This is way cool to have (Spencer) writing on the blog. Amazing people who inspire us to look beyond them and ourselves.


  8. kenh says:

    Thank you Spencer for your wonderful insights. I have found in my life that there have been many times that Christ was striving to draw me nearer to Him to help me grow by having certain special experiences occur that were designed to get me to think about and desire to understand certain spiritual principles. Many of these were things that I had not previously spent time contemplating before. President Kimball mentioned this as having rested upon a spiritual plateau before being ready to climb upward to a higher spiritual plateau. Christ knows where we are and what we are prepared to know, understand, and incorporate into our lives by prodding us through the Holy Spirit and placing in our life’s path certain situations and people to move us along in an upward climb for us to become a Zion-like person. John Pontius was such a person in my life as he has been for so many here at this blog. In my small way to try to help anyone who is seeking to understand many of the wonderful things that you mentioned Spencer in your post, may I say that it is not just one thing. It starts with a longing to be true to ourselves, our real selves. It is the out pouring of our deepest, heart-felt desires to feel that heavenly love that we have been filled with forever. It brings us to a point that we find ourselves stripped of pride and ego, humbled and upon knees without a moments thought of what to say or any possible time frame, alone and in desperate need of comfort and love that only God can provide. Our moment of truth that changes us internally and eternally at the same time. Our reaching upward must come from the depths of humility, being totally honest with ourselves and spiritually naked before God. Having been through this process so many times I hope this helps. Thank you again Spencer.


  9. Hehea says:

    Thank you, Spencer, for this post. Simple and profound.


  10. I am so thrilled to see this, for I have been thinking about this very same concept the last few days. I don’t want to pressure or alienate my boys and my husband. They are all righteous, good men, but not even close to thinking about these ideas and concepts.

    I love the answer Spencer gives in regards to the idea that our love, our clarity, and our faith will cause those around us to shift and change naturally. (at least that is how I read that). There may be pain involved, as we can’t convert everyone around us and as we may decline offerings of the ‘world’, but just as Christ was loved by those who walked with Him and Joseph Smith was respected even by his enemies most times I think we are to learn love and kindness is the answer. It must depend on how we address this every day struggle of being in the world but not if it.

    A recent miracle changed me to the core of my beliefs, and since then the world is opening up almost to quickly for me to keep up with it. At the time if this miracle a few close friends and clients of mine just quit coming around….one friendship of years had a bit of a falling out. At the time I didn’t understand this, but in retrospect I see my own life was clearing out people who brought about energy of doubt. In their place are loving, light filled friends looking for more. I believe if we stand in the best place possible we will beinspired when and where to speak, what to say, and how to touch those around us. That will be part of our own changing.

    I thought of this as I was cleaning, doing dishes and other ‘menial’ tasks…. I couldn’t help but wonder why these tedious daily requirements will take so much of my time!
    I am grateful for this post today, it has given me much to ponder.


  11. Vickie Lynne says:

    It is comforting to have Spencer on docket, answering questions. It is amazing to me how John and Spencer got together to accomplish all they did before our beloved friend passed. As Spencer has said, all things have purpose.

    I got Spencer’s story (the book) written by John, in November. Now I am reading it again. There was so much I missed the first time. The other day I was pondering how we could do as Spencer said, to make our flesh rise up to the caliber of our spirits. That is a genuine goal for most of us. And now I see that the question has been posed for Spencer to answer. Spencer, you are doing a wonderful job addressing it and keeping the topic alive.

    There is an urgency in the air for us to “get into position with the Lord” because we feel our world changing and it is time to act. I am sure that is why God led Spencer and John together so this book could be written, and the Unblogers could have contact with like minds. I really appreciate that this blog is still open even through the passing of our dear friend. It is strange to me how he was taken right after the book came out.


  12. robert putman says:

    spencer, i needed to hear this so badly, the trails of this life have dragged me down and its not where i want to be….i have all the same feellings as stated here, and long for Zion…..im grateful for this blog, and i know we shall miss john, but in my heart im so happy for him, and pray for his family…thank you.


  13. Kenneth Card says:


    Please help me to understand as a brother. I hunger to really know how to have a relationship with Christ and Father. I want to see them with my own eyes and hear their voice with my own ears while in the flesh and not that of another.

    You speak of “oneness” in “heart,” “purpose,” and “spirit”… are these words really defining what attributes of godliness we should manifesting in our thoughts, words and deeds? Are we really here to “be holy” in thought, word and deed? Is this what Christ did to be “one” with his Father? Is this the “truth” Christ and the Father has been trying to teach us in all the experiences we undergo? Is mortality all about developing a godly character wherein we sacrifice on the alter our ego and hypocrisy and put on the new man of holiness of character?

    Does it really matter what religion we belong to or don’t belong to if we are seeking to “be holy” in our character (which would be our thoughts, words, deeds and beliefs)?


  14. Dee says:

    Well said…the Lord gave you the words to explain this place that words have new meanings so they are hard to find but through the spirit of The Lord. Thank you thank you for being you and being here for us. I have prayed so long for someone who I could relate with. Nephi understood this challenge of putting such things in words. He understood that he was being ask to write the sacred things on plates of brass but that he might err because of being still in mortality and speaking to others who were still in different stages of their prefect journey. Joy err like a true mistake but he was speaking of this challenge that you Spencer just walked through. To speak of things that are sacred and can only be understood in whole though, understanding and experiences not word alone. I want to thank you for writing on this blog because those of us that can relate to the spirit behind the words or want to are drawn to Father to ask what the meaning of these things are. This opens a sacred door the few conversation open. Even if you err I excuse you and pray you do too for the gift of your words are eternal and I for one rejoice in them and receive all I can today and will more tomorrow. Thank you my brother in Christ.


  15. Leo says:


    We have experienced the same thing. My wife and I switched from cable to streaming because other than the BYU channel (which you can stream), nothing else on tv had any appeal to us anymore. We’ve also experienced a difficulty in helping others see what we now see and feel what we now feel. However, Spencer’s response reminds me that it’s best to express it without words. It’s most effective when done by the Savior’s love being expressed through me to others.

    Also, I think this change you describe is part of what Mosiah’s people experienced. Remember, they experienced such a change that they 1) had no desire to do evil and 2) desired to do good continually. Melchizedek’s people could not look upon sin save with abhorrence, such was their change. In that light it’s not surprising that we don’t want to watch the filth contained in most television programs anymore. It violates 1 and 2 because much of today’s media draws us away from the Lord (1) and we could be doing something good with that time instead (2).

    I think these desires are good and of God.

    However, we are also commanded to be happy so don’t be afraid to lighten up a little, especially with the children. Those are my two cents.


    • E says:

      Thank you Leo for your “two cents” worth of kind words. I was nervous to even post my question. I’m rather private about my spiritual thoughts, so it was through the prompting of my friend that I even posted my question. Lighten up–yes! 🙂 But I am glad to think that I might be moving toward that “change of heart.”


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